In the pursuit of freedom

[SamfromWA]

We sometimes forget that we've traded a lot for our new found convenience in the modern world. Freedom was the first casualty, if the food supply broke down today how many would survive? What if medicine stopped being delivered, or fuel ran out or the electricity turned off. We live in crazy times... people often say these things could never happen but things are more fragile than most people realise. No nations are independent anymore, we are all heavily reliant on imports for many essential goods. Many have likely noticed certain things are becoming a lot harder to find not to mention the steep increases in price. There's no harm in becoming more independent other than it being less convenient and you might have to think for yourself a lot more but just like a muscle the brain wastes away without use. Perhaps the biggest benefit is health, once you cut out all the toxins we've been forced to ingest health improves dramatically.

For those who want to relearn what we once new and in a sense start become human again you don't need much. All you need to do is get started planting, no detailed guides, no expensive equipment, just plant what ever you already have access to. They might be old potatoes thrown out from the kitchen, seeds from an apple core, rotten tomatoes, seeds from a melon, some cuttings from a neighbour, seeds or plants that are growing wild. There's no substitute for the real thing, those with their hands in the dirt will learn fast but if you never get started you will never learn. There's going to be some failure but if you keep thinking and trying different things you will have some success. Once you know a bit about growing plants you can scale up if a time comes when you need it. Small growing areas are no excuse, until every inch of soil is covered in food its not like you've used up all your space. If you get to the point where you want to grow all your own food, aiming for a ton per person is a good amount, so yes grow things that are easy to grow and high yielding as you need as much as you can.

There's so much knowledge lost about how to live for ourselves but it can be rediscovered, necessity drives innovation so few are working hard on such things now but given the circumstances around the world i think that might be starting to change. The simpler you can do things the better in my experience, i grow all my food mixed together and it seems to grow better, planting what ever i have at the time in a mix. It costs a lot of energy to grow food, if you spend more than you get back you're going to starve pretty quickly so keep things as easy as possible. Save seeds each generation and they will become better adapted over time and don't use poisons, the microbes that live throughout the body are just as much a part of you as your own cells and they are just as important. The microbes in the gut break down and release nutrients from food but they also create nutrients like proteins and b vitamins. Others have been shown to actively fight cancers and disease in the body, some even repair damage in the brain. Very few cause disease and can usually only take hold when there's some sort of disruption to the community, much like a garden densely filled with plants there's very few resources available for weeds to get established. You are a community of lifeforms like a garden, even plants take in beneficial microbes from their environment in the form of endophytes and will inoculate their own seed so that the community can build cooperation over generations.

Its not easy but its enjoyable, there's always more to learn, in my mind everything people can do to regain their freedom is a step in the right direction so i hope as many people as possible can do so.

 

[Mandy Onderwater]

It's part of the reason why I try to grow new cuttings frequently, so that I can spread the love. I already have the plant growing, why not share it for free? Spread the love? I have plenty, so others may as well enjoy it too.

 

[Cathy]

I have been watching a lovely lady on YT that has a permaculture garden and she was discussing the ethics of the practice and it touched on the ideal of sharing instead of homesteading and propping. She likes the idea of giving your surplus to help the less fortunate but I liked the idea of sharing your knowledge to help people be selfsufficient. Her reply was that some people just can't afford it or don't have space. I didn't get into a discussion over it as she is a from Portland in America and is a socialist and I'm from Bundaberg and a conservative and we live extremely different lives and have very different lived experiences.

A pack of seeds is $2 and I remember going in with an old bread knife to cut away the turf and a shovel with a broken handle purchased from the tip. It was a hard slog but those plants grew so well in that untouched fertile soil.

My next garden bed was a cane mulch bale raised bed as I'm in a sugar cane growing area so it was cheap and I've been growing and learning ever since. Growing in a subtropical climate I probably failed at 50% of my crops because I was following the regular schedule and it was discovering Mark and Self Sufficient Me that I learnt about sub tropical seasons and my success rate was 70%.

That free knowledge from Mark improved my growing success and help relieve all of my stress about why I was struggling growing food in such a lush growing area......

 

[SamfromWA]

I have been watching a lovely lady on YT that has a permaculture garden and she was discussing the ethics of the practice and it touched on the ideal of sharing instead of homesteading and propping. She likes the idea of giving your surplus to help the less fortunate but I liked the idea of sharing your knowledge to help people be selfsufficient. Her reply was that some people just can't afford it or don't have space. I didn't get into a discussion over it as she is a from Portland in America and is a socialist and I'm from Bundaberg and a conservative and we live extremely different lives and have very different lived experiences.

A pack of seeds is $2 and I remember going in with an old bread knife to cut away the turf and a shovel with a broken handle purchased from the tip. It was a hard slog but those plants grew so well in that untouched fertile soil.

My next garden bed was a cane mulch bale raised bed as I'm in a sugar cane growing area so it was cheap and I've been growing and learning ever since. Growing in a subtropical climate I probably failed at 50% of my crops because I was following the regular schedule and it was discovering Mark and Self Sufficient Me that I learnt about sub tropical seasons and my success rate was 70%.

That free knowledge from Mark improved my growing success and help relieve all of my stress about why I was struggling growing food in such a lush growing area......

I agree, i was once talking to a very religious individual and he mentioned i was selfish for encouraging others to grow food but yet not donating large parts of what i was growing, yet he didn't want to do any of the effort of growing food or taking care of his own life himself. In the past i have given plants and seeds away but almost all of what i gave away was never planted and had somehow became worthless just because it was given to them. As harsh as it is we are ultimately responsible for our own lives and there is no fair reason why the burden each of our lives has to be carried by another. Thinking like that ultimately leads to the productive giving up on being productive as their efforts are stolen and then everyone starves. Its a parasitic mindset and eventually it kills the host. A community is built on cooperation not welfare, if we help each other we succeed if we steal from each other everything falls apart, as is being learned now throughout the world. But perhaps i'm geting too political for a forum like this

 

[Lunai]

I do agree with both of you. That said, I'm not political active in any direction or religious for that matter. I really do like to gift self-made stuff away to people where I really know that they like it and appreciate it. It's the same with plants and produce from the garden. But I really dislike it if I learn that stuff I gifted gets thrown away or just wastes away like plants that don't get planted or handmade stuff that never gets looked at. If I notice those people around me I'm petty enough to make sure they don't get enything of that sort frm me but see and know that I still give them away to others 😅 petty me 🙈🤭 had someone ask me why they didn't get something like that and I just told them that I know they don't like it and that's that.

That said. I think you really don't have to bring religion or politics into it. Just use common sense and argue with that 😁 helping people to help themself is always the best option. That includes giving them the knowledge of how to do stuff 🤷‍♀️simple as that. And yes I know that common sense isn't that common 🤪sadly😅

 

[Mandy Onderwater]

How dare they call that selfish! Sharing knowledge is never selfish. You are giving people the best possible opportunity to start out for themselves as well. And if you really inspire people and they ask if you would be so willing to make a donation and actually intend on planting it, if you have it, I doubt you'll deny such a request.

We have a small garden nearby, not a clue who owns it honestly, but every once in a while there'll be fruit and such sitting on a table just outside it's gates, free for picks. I wish I knew who owned it, as I'd love to help out. Instead, for now, I'll gratefully take some fruit (usually lemons or grapefruit). I'm thinking of putting little pots with seedlings there as well, but I worry that they would dry out and die too quickly in this harsh weather.

 

[SamfromWA]

I do agree with both of you. That said, I'm not political active in any direction or religious for that matter. I really do like to gift self-made stuff away to people where I really know that they like it and appreciate it. It's the same with plants and produce from the garden. But I really dislike it if I learn that stuff I gifted gets thrown away or just wastes away like plants that don't get planted or handmade stuff that never gets looked at. If I notice those people around me I'm petty enough to make sure they don't get enything of that sort frm me but see and know that I still give them away to others 😅 petty me 🙈🤭 had someone ask me why they didn't get something like that and I just told them that I know they don't like it and that's that.

That said. I think you really don't have to bring religion or politics into it. Just use common sense and argue with that 😁 helping people to help themself is always the best option. That includes giving them the knowledge of how to do stuff 🤷‍♀️simple as that. And yes I know that common sense isn't that common 🤪sadly😅

Yep i should say that that i am religious myself and have no problem with such things but i think it was used in this example as an excuse. The sorts of people that grow things that are given to them are the sorts of people that are likely to send things back when they have spare plants or seeds, so it tends to be cooperation and is a good way to do things as everyone gets more.

 

[SamfromWA]

How dare they call that selfish! Sharing knowledge is never selfish. You are giving people the best possible opportunity to start out for themselves as well. And if you really inspire people and they ask if you would be so willing to make a donation and actually intend on planting it, if you have it, I doubt you'll deny such a request.

We have a small garden nearby, not a clue who owns it honestly, but every once in a while there'll be fruit and such sitting on a table just outside it's gates, free for picks. I wish I knew who owned it, as I'd love to help out. Instead, for now, I'll gratefully take some fruit (usually lemons or grapefruit). I'm thinking of putting little pots with seedlings there as well, but I worry that they would dry out and die too quickly in this harsh weather.

I think it might have been a priest of from a priests family which i don't have any issue with but the idea that its always up to someone else to save people annoys me greatly. The world and the economy is certainly set up to crush those who work, but its being made continuously worse by all those who don't work. The long term cost of land and housing before the criminals in charge shifted to a fiat currency was around a years wages, ever since its been getting 4 times more expensive every generation as they print more money until the point now where we have to spend our entire lives paying for it. As well as taxation (driven by welfare expansion), regulation and red tape are driving business everywhere into the ground. If we were free to live our lives it would be an extremely easy to provide for ourselves, the idea that more criminal governments is the solution is like putting fuel onto the fire and hoping it goes out. As things get progressively more difficult and governments fail the only real solution is to provide for ourselves.

 

[Cathy]

For those that say to stay away from politics and religion, they don't understand that politics and religion are why we are here today.
The trick is to use manners and respect and not push it into every conversation because it can make others uncomfortable.

I think that socialism takes away charity. We are so taxed and "cared for" by the government that the traditional act of giving to those in need by those that had extra to give becomes more difficult because we don't have extra any more.

Late last year I found a great little Pentecostal church that I started going to. Everyone around me that I became friends with over the last 3 years all believe in God and the majority go to church every Sunday so I just kept myself open to finding a good place to connect with like minded people.

I think in these very difficult times it can't hurt to make a stronger community.

 

[Lunai]

For those that say to stay away from politics and religion, they don't understand that politics and religion are why we are here today.
The trick is to use manners and respect and not push it into every conversation because it can make others uncomfortable.

I think that socialism takes away charity. We are so taxed and "cared for" by the government that the traditional act of giving to those in need by those that had extra to give becomes more difficult because we don't have extra any more.

Late last year I found a great little Pentecostal church that I started going to. Everyone around me that I became friends with over the last 3 years all believe in God and the majority go to church every Sunday so I just kept myself open to finding a good place to connect with like minded people.

I think in these very difficult times it can't hurt to make a stronger community.

I'm honest with you in that regard. I was raised katholic (not the strict ones but nonetheless), I've grown up and learned the ways but from early on it wasalien to me and I couldn't connect. That said I'm one of those that go with the saying: live and let live. You can believe what you want if you let me believe what I want.
I for myself just can't connect with something (or someone) that used the "believe in god" as an excuse to enslave, torture or even whipe out whole countries (not to speak of the control the church still has. for example 50 % of all business/companies in germany are still owned by the churches). It doesn't applie to just christianity but that's what I was raised with. In addition to that I can't wrap my head around the so called fact that everything was created by one beeing. I just can't.
However I do believe that there is a force that drives the Universe (because energy must come from something, it can't just pop up) but I don't think, that that thing is a humanoid called god.

That aside I really do think it's good to create tight knit communities, however they might come. IF they use common sense and don't try to force their way on someone else.

 

[SamfromWA]

The issue we have is one group wants to take ever more of what little productive people have while the other just wants to be left alone. Two diametrically opposed views. In the past year I've seen more businesses shut down than in the entirety of my lifetime and that exodus is rapidly getting worse. Those who are productive are losing faith in the system and giving up, as the currency inflates far beyond the "official" figures rendering their income and savings worthless along with all the other massive problems especially housing costs. Its a losing game no matter how you play. If nothing is produced, all the money in the world can't buy a thing. Learning the skills to provide for yourself helps in almost every situation we might end up in and there's a very real urgency to do so. Building a community of such people would give even greater safety and security and is well worth doing, the only issue is there are so few such people.

 

[JP 1983]

There are many aetiological (causative) agents as to why we have arrived at where we are. Some of these include: globalisation, as the gradual bifurcation of society into two clear stratum, the parasite (rich, ruling) class who have plans and goals for the entire planet and the propaganda apparatus to make us believe their BS, and the slave (poor, working) classes, including the inability of the working class to now change the ruling class due to utterly corrupt 'democratic' voting systems; industrialisation, which moved food production into fewer and fewer hands that eventually became that curse word, "Big Ag"; urbanisation, as unemployed and disenfranchised rural folks moved to cities to find work, homes and build a life with some kind of meaning because a small farm sure as hell aint an enjoyable life no more; education, as it became loaded with State-sponsored ideological agendas which cast traditional activities like farming in a bad light (look at all the 'evils' of cattle methane production nowadays, or the emerging technocratic "bug farm" and "fake meat" industries), let alone the fact that parents themselves lost the knowledge of foraging and/or growing their own food as industrialisation took over food production.

I observe that there are significant ideological differences between what the parasites are trying to force upon us from above, and what the "homesteading" or "sustainability" crowds are trying to achieve for themselves. Sam summed it up well:

one group wants to take ever more of what little productive people have while the other just wants to be left alone. Two diametrically opposed views.

We cannot survive with a productivity vacuum called "government" constantly making scripted, co-ordinated and totally STUPID decisions which have destroyed economies, livelihoods, businesses etc, such as the insanity of the COnVID psyop, and yes I'm going to get real political over that one (really? you need to lock down a state/country because of "virus" with a 99.86% survival rate, increasing to 99.999% survival when actually treated properly? And you need to cripple the entire working class by forcing them to be injected with a toxic poison which supposedly 'saves' them from that 99.999% survivable illness?! Six of my co-workers were permanently injured and will never return to work because of that damn jab; one DIED, and I know of others who died in short order after their shot of the worst vaccine of all time).

After Labor took the reigns of government in Australia, 2022, the Fair Work Commission raised the minimum wage to $21.38/hr and also made a decision which forces farmers to pay an hourly picking rate (rather than quantity rate they had before). NT Rep. Jacinta Nampijinpa Price remarked in her first speech how this move has crippled Australian businesses, and that tax cuts are what delivers money straight into working class pockets. Again, we have an (s)elected government making decisions contrary to the will of their electorates.

The usury (interest) banking system likewise continues to vacuum money away from where its needed and deposit it straight into the parasite-class pockets. Any discussion of a collaborative future cannot fail to address this, and go futher by creating a 0 (ZERO) interest parallel loan system that will deliver the working class from the hands of the parasites. That sadly requires more capital than folks have to throw at it, and legislatures will surely react by outlawing systems that compete with the usury system. From a religious standpoint, I remain incredulous that Christianity as a whole (and to a similar extent, Islam), have both happily embraced the usury banking system without a quibble of conscience, whereas any cursory reading of 15-18th century works would betray how alien and abhorrent it once was to lend to someone at interest (see Shakespeare's Merchant of Venice for example) in both of those religious systems. The abolition of interest is something that has been lost which must be recovered if the homesteading and sustainability movements are to succeed. I cannot afford to buy a rural property, especially not at 6% interest (let alone 10%, where our interest rate will go over the next 3-5 years). If the community sponsored its own growth at 0% interest, it will surely succeed.

The pervasive gloom of pessimism makes me wonder if we really can turn it around and create the world we want to see, as so artistically encapsulated by Bob Moran:

 

[SamfromWA]

There are many aetiological (causative) agents as to why we have arrived at where we are. Some of these include: globalisation, as the gradual bifurcation of society into two clear stratum, the parasite (rich, ruling) class who have plans and goals for the entire planet and the propaganda apparatus to make us believe their BS, and the slave (poor, working) classes, including the inability of the working class to now change the ruling class due to utterly corrupt 'democratic' voting systems; industrialisation, which moved food production into fewer and fewer hands that eventually became that curse word, "Big Ag"; urbanisation, as unemployed and disenfranchised rural folks moved to cities to find work, homes and build a life with some kind of meaning because a small farm sure as hell aint an enjoyable life no more; education, as it became loaded with State-sponsored ideological agendas which cast traditional activities like farming in a bad light (look at all the 'evils' of cattle methane production nowadays, or the emerging technocratic "bug farm" and "fake meat" industries), let alone the fact that parents themselves lost the knowledge of foraging and/or growing their own food as industrialisation took over food production.

I observe that there are significant ideological differences between what the parasites are trying to force upon us from above, and what the "homesteading" or "sustainability" crowds are trying to achieve for themselves. Sam summed it up well:

We cannot survive with a productivity vacuum called "government" constantly making scripted, co-ordinated and totally STUPID decisions which have destroyed economies, livelihoods, businesses etc, such as the insanity of the COnVID psyop, and yes I'm going to get real political over that one (really? you need to lock down a state/country because of "virus" with a 99.86% survival rate, increasing to 99.999% survival when actually treated properly? And you need to cripple the entire working class by forcing them to be injected with a toxic poison which supposedly 'saves' them from that 99.999% survivable illness?! Six of my co-workers were permanently injured and will never return to work because of that damn jab; one DIED, and I know of others who died in short order after their shot of the worst vaccine of all time).

After Labor took the reigns of government in Australia, 2022, the Fair Work Commission raised the minimum wage to $21.38/hr and also made a decision which forces farmers to pay an hourly picking rate (rather than quantity rate they had before). NT Rep. Jacinta Nampijinpa Price remarked in her first speech how this move has crippled Australian businesses, and that tax cuts are what delivers money straight into working class pockets. Again, we have an (s)elected government making decisions contrary to the will of their electorates.

The usury (interest) banking system likewise continues to vacuum money away from where its needed and deposit it straight into the parasite-class pockets. Any discussion of a collaborative future cannot fail to address this, and go futher by creating a 0 (ZERO) interest parallel loan system that will deliver the working class from the hands of the parasites. That sadly requires more capital than folks have to throw at it, and legislatures will surely react by outlawing systems that compete with the usury system. From a religious standpoint, I remain incredulous that Christianity as a whole (and to a similar extent, Islam), have both happily embraced the usury banking system without a quibble of conscience, whereas any cursory reading of 15-18th century works would betray how alien and abhorrent it once was to lend to someone at interest (see Shakespeare's Merchant of Venice for example) in both of those religious systems. The abolition of interest is something that has been lost which must be recovered if the homesteading and sustainability movements are to succeed. I cannot afford to buy a rural property, especially not at 6% interest (let alone 10%, where our interest rate will go over the next 3-5 years). If the community sponsored its own growth at 0% interest, it will surely succeed.

The pervasive gloom of pessimism makes me wonder if we really can turn it around and create the world we want to see, as so artistically encapsulated by Bob Moran:

Very true JP and i agree with you on all points, all organisations no matter how well intentioned in the beginning have become corrupt, including the church. One thing i would add is that the price of most things including land is also strongly influenced by government as they are typically the largest purchasers and also control all laws as well as many of the costs. The vaccine is certainly a major problem and is on its own one of the biggest causes of the issues every ones facing. The problem is our governments continuously shutting any conversation about it down because this isn't accidental, its a controlled demolition. There's a lot i could share on various topics, but when you do you get silenced pretty quick. If people knew about what was going on they likely wouldn't be turning up for work the next day, they'd be getting ready.

Mandy am i able to share a link to a social media website on here?

​

 

[Lunai]

Very true JP and i agree with you on all points, all organisations no matter how well intentioned in the beginning have become corrupt, including the church. One thing i would add is that the price of most things including land is also strongly influenced by government as they are typically the largest purchasers and also control all laws as well as many of the costs. The vaccine is certainly a major problem and is on its own one of the biggest causes of the issues every ones facing. The problem is our governments continuously shutting any conversation about it down because this isn't accidental, its a controlled demolition. There's a lot i could share on various topics, but when you do you get silenced pretty quick. If people knew about what was going on they likely wouldn't be turning up for work the next day, they'd be getting ready.

Mandy am i able to share a link to a social media website on here?

​

you should be able to share a link with your status, as we share the "well known member" status and i can share links

 

[SamfromWA]

you should be able to share a link with your status, as we share the "well known member" status and i can share links

Yep i just don't want to be stirring up more trouble than i already have, i'm aware that the moderators have little choice in a lot of things. Its not one of the well known social media pages, more of a freedom inspired network, or at least hoping to be as the sites a little clunky but i hope they get the bumps ironed out. If it sounds ok to the moderators i can put the site up.

 

[Mandy Onderwater]

Very true JP and i agree with you on all points, all organisations no matter how well intentioned in the beginning have become corrupt, including the church. One thing i would add is that the price of most things including land is also strongly influenced by government as they are typically the largest purchasers and also control all laws as well as many of the costs. The vaccine is certainly a major problem and is on its own one of the biggest causes of the issues every ones facing. The problem is our governments continuously shutting any conversation about it down because this isn't accidental, its a controlled demolition. There's a lot i could share on various topics, but when you do you get silenced pretty quick. If people knew about what was going on they likely wouldn't be turning up for work the next day, they'd be getting ready.

Mandy am i able to share a link to a social media website on here?

​

Yes, provided it follows the guidelines. But I assume you'd be fine.

*edit: The forum isn't too strict. We mainly don't like spam, unsafe locations, etc. We want this to be an informative, safe and happy community. Most of our rules are fairly simply based around that.

 

[SamfromWA]

For anyone wanting to try and start to build a community i think this is a good site to network with others trying to do the same thing, not everyone is focused on self sufficiency there but some are, many different types of people but all sick of the current system. Has a few issues, notifications are all over the place and its a bit disorderly but i do hope they can get it sorted as the people who use the site are mostly free thinking and decent people. Very, very few people world wide are doing such things but we have to start somewhere. If you see people in your area and you like what they're doing its worth getting out of your comfort zone and connecting with each other. https://freedomcells.org/

 

[Mandy Onderwater]

I've had a look and it's not something that suits my personal preferences. But glad there's something out there others do enjoy

 

[JP 1983]

https://freedomcells.org/

The irony of that site is it centralises information of the cells and their members into a single place easily subpoenaed by any intelligence agency...

 

[SamfromWA]

The irony of that site is it centralises information of the cells and their members into a single place easily subpoenaed by any intelligence agency...

That's true, but everything that is done online is effectively monitored and just meeting with people and talking isn't illegal as of yet.